Are we taking video games too seriously?

[oskar-det]

Where I live, in Sweden, the media is taking video games very seriously. I mean, VERY seriously. If you show the "wrong" thing in games, the game will get bashed in media.

For example, if you show scantily clad girls in your games, the media will call the game sexistic and lower its score. Also, there's a constant debate over the fact that many games portay women as scantily clad sidekicks to the male hero.

I seriously don't get it. For me video games are ENTERTAINMENT, not a way to show what's right and wrong. There's a reason there are lots of chicks with jiggly boobs in fighting games - males like to play fighting games, most females don't.

What Swedish media is trying to achieve is to talk everyone into there can be one single game that attracts equally males and females. While that certainly is true for some genres, I strongly beleive it's not the case for most.

Men and women like different things. I know some people are going to argue that with all this genus research that is being made these days, but I believe that no matter what characters you have in a fighting game, women in general won't be interested in it because it's STILL a fighting game!

What "sexist" developers are doing is simply giving the crowd what they want. And why do media believe that video games are super serious business? Do they want to be taken seriously by society? That is a generation question.

Or just look at my flabby ass physics thread. Am I taking that too seriously myself? Maybe.

Should video games be whimsical entertainment or do we need people who'll never be interested in games anyway to respect it?

[Branden_Lucero]

well that depends if its entertaining but enjoyable, or entertaining to pass time. and sometimes i just feel the need of both happening. sometimes i'll just be entertained happily. other times, time goes by.

[Scream]

I think the power gamers take video games too seriously, all this trophy/achievement nonsense people feel they just have to do. When the game has stopped being fun/immersive and your just going around collecting/hoarding useless stuff, please just put the controller down and walk away..

[WeskerSexyCheez]

People are always bitching about how female characters are shown, but in the end games attract women in large numbers as well as guys. If they'd bothered to examine the differences between games now and games before companies became well aware that they had a different demographic they could sell to they would probably decide that most games now aren't really that bad. As a woman and feminist, I really enjoy playing videogames and though I won't claim that there is never anything I find offensive, it depends largely on interpretation; some people would argue that having strong, confident women in games is sexist too and you never see women shown realistically, but that has always struck me as a pretty stupid arguement seeing as how you can't claim male characters are ever realistic either.

[oskar-det]

@Scream: Well said. Many people don't play for fun today, but rather for status.

@WeskerSexyCheez: Aren't most developers just trying to create a "dream world" in video games? Women look gorgeous with curvy bodies and all kinds of different personalities, and males looks pretty gorgeous too.

I found this funny in Mario games. In Sweden (and I'm sure it's the same in other countries as well) Mario games are kind of "holy" and you rarely see media bash a new Mario game because princess Peach is so feminine and weak and always wears pink. I think it's because Mario games have already established a culture way back then, and you don't mess with what's established.

Some guys, like myself, find weak women who are in need of a helping male extremely attractive. Others find strong, independant women just as attractive. The question is, is either option wrong? It's just a matter of different tastes.

And, are we taking games so seriously we believe that they impact society in different ways when it comes to character portyisation?

[Alexia_Ashford]

I don't. The fact so many people enjoyed Deadly Premonition shows me that, but that is a rare gem. Usually, if a game is broken, it just doesn't sell well. I think some people might take games too seriously. I buy any old shit to give it a chance, that's why I buy so many indie games off XBLA.

[Darkmoon]

Where I live, in Sweden, the media is taking video games very seriously. I mean, VERY seriously. If you show the "wrong" thing in games, the game will get bashed in media.

For example, if you show scantily clad girls in your games, the media will call the game sexistic and lower its score. Also, there's a constant debate over the fact that many games portay women as scantily clad sidekicks to the male hero.

I seriously don't get it. For me video games are ENTERTAINMENT, not a way to show what's right and wrong. There's a reason there are lots of chicks with jiggly boobs in fighting games - males like to play fighting games, most females don't.

What Swedish media is trying to achieve is to talk everyone into there can be one single game that attracts equally males and females. While that certainly is true for some genres, I strongly beleive it's not the case for most.

Men and women like different things. I know some people are going to argue that with all this genus research that is being made these days, but I believe that no matter what characters you have in a fighting game, women in general won't be interested in it because it's STILL a fighting game!

What "sexist" developers are doing is simply giving the crowd what they want. And why do media believe that video games are super serious business? Do they want to be taken seriously by society? That is a generation question.

Or just look at my flabby ass physics thread. Am I taking that too seriously myself? Maybe.

Should video games be whimsical entertainment or do we need people who'll never be interested in games anyway to respect it?

This is the unfortunate backlash of giving people what they want when the majority of your audience is young, hormonal kids. Simply put, I prefer female characters who are portrayed as equals to the male ones. There clothing is less relevant unless it's obviously just a stupid attempt to sell more games by giving teenagers erections. If the woman can hold her own and isn't treated like a lesser character then I'm less annoyed that she's journeying through the Arctic in a bikini, but only somewhat.

Simply put, I reckon if you're going to have pure eye candy women in a game then the guys should be too. The Japanese seem to do that quite a lot - see the bishounen trend. Other game developers seem to go, 'Well, the main character is clothed head to toe in heavy plate, so the female lead should wear a chain mail bikin that look like it takes a mechanic three hour to get back out her ass.'

I tend to play games with a more serious plotline, though, so usually the female characters are actually clothed in those.

[oskar-det]

This is the unfortunate backlash of giving people what they want when the majority of your audience is young, hormonal kids. Simply put, I prefer female characters who are portrayed as equals to the male ones. There clothing is less relevant unless it's obviously just a stupid attempt to sell more games by giving teenagers erections. If the woman can hold her own and isn't treated like a lesser character then I'm less annoyed that she's journeying through the Arctic in a bikini, but only somewhat.

Simply put, I reckon if you're going to have pure eye candy women in a game then the guys should be too. The Japanese seem to do that quite a lot - see the bishounen trend. Other game developers seem to go, 'Well, the main character is clothed head to toe in heavy plate, so the female lead should wear a chain mail bikin that look like it takes a mechanic three hour to get back out her ass.'

I tend to play games with a more serious plotline, though, so usually the female characters are actually clothed in those.

I love me some eye candy but I'm no "hormonic teenager". I think that's a huge stereotype while in fact most guys like a little eye candy in games... even married ones, LOL.

Also, I can perfectly see why developers put scantily clad females who have to be saved by fully clothed men - it's because men are buying the product! Some people seem to think that ALL games need to attract both male and female, when in fact different games attract different sexes.

Japan has understood this since long. Visit a manga store in Akiba and you'll see that the section are EXTREMELY separated. Some sections only hold manga for women, loke BL manga, while other sections only hold manga for men.

The point is not to exclude women, they're also consumers with money to be spent. The point is to create products for the right crowd. What Swedish media seem to be dreaming of are products that cater to BOTH male and female at the same time. While there are such genres, I believe it's much better to create games that are tailormade for men and women.

I should also add there's a crazy wave of feminism in Sweden these days where EVERYTHING is supposed to be perfectly equal and people seriously believe that men and women are identical save for physical diffrences.

[WeskerSexyCheez]

Wouldn't be doing my job if I didn't point out that feminism waves are GOOD things because they force people to consider the level of gender equality in their country and if they can even call it that in the first place.

I don't actually think eyecandy is Necessary or even sells more than simple good storytelling or excellent gameplay. Sometimes it may take a while for people to come around and realise it, but not always. Look at Portal. You can’t deny how ridiculously popular it is with the closest thing to eyecandy being a single picture of Chell in the sequel with a tank top. A TANK TOP. What I'd like people to realise is that while scantily clad women in games isn't harming women nearly as much as many would like to believe, it actually can't hurt to leave out the cheap selling points and focus on what really counts. It depends on what games appeal to you in the end, however. It isn't like Dead Or Alive would be anywhere without lots and lots of breasts.

[oskar-det]

Wouldn't be doing my job if I didn't point out that feminism waves are GOOD things because they force people to consider the level of gender equality in their country and if they can even call it that in the first place.

I don't actually think eyecandy is Necessary or even sells more than simple good storytelling or excellent gameplay. Sometimes it may take a while for people to come around and realise it, but not always. Look at Portal. You can’t deny how ridiculously popular it is with the closest thing to eyecandy being a single picture of Chell in the sequel with a tank top. A TANK TOP. What I'd like people to realise is that while scantily clad women in games isn't harming women nearly as much as many would like to believe, it actually can't hurt to leave out the cheap selling points and focus on what really counts. It depends on what games appeal to you in the end, however. It isn't like Dead Or Alive would be anywhere without lots and lots of breasts.

I'm all for equality as long as it's not dumb. For example, in Sweden, it's all the rage now to hire more women in certain business. Not because of their qualifications, but because of their gender. THAT is sexism if you ask me. Let's say a man has more experience and better graduation than this woman, then they'll hire the woman anyway because she's a woman, all for the sake of feminism and "equality". It's fucking madness, but that's how it is today. That's why I'm for equality but not feminism. I actually hate the latter.

Of course it doesn't hurt. People are just overreacting, especially since many women are so insecure about their looks. And then they see how perfect women look in video games and... there you go. Shit storm started.

Let's take a game like The Mercenaries 3D. Why include Rebecca's loli nurse outfit? It's pure fan service for males and that's about it. What's wrong with that? I don't believe fan service alone drives sales, but it's a part of the big picture. It's part of driving sales, even if there are lots of other parts to go with it.

[Mr. Spencer]

I'm beginning to think this bloke is a market researcher.

[oskar-det]

I'm beginning to think this bloke is a market researcher.

You're right. I was hired by a rival company to Umbrella in order to spy on The Horror and report of their behaviours.

[Mr. Spencer]

Fucking called it.

[jimmyjoejangles]

got him!
also I don't think video game players take video games seriously, its the people who don't play that have the biggest problem with it

[Dough]

I think gamers take "the media" too seriously