metal gear solid

[Rombie]

WTF? Hell no, TTS was a mangled pile of bad design choices. Not even touching the debatable issues of the over the top cutscenes and the bored (and accent-less) voice work, the adding the gameplay mechanics from SOL into completely unchanged MGS maps meant the game was entirely broken.

You had open spaces with FPS shooting meaning enemies were not an issue, you could hang and climb around every obstacle put in the original game. To make matters worse the designers decided that the game needed no backtracking at all, and so the two events where that takes place can be completely bypassed. The thing was a breeze to play even on hardest settings, compared to the challenge that was the Extreme modes of the PS1 original.

All TTS was good for in it's time was eye candy, and even that today is fairly weak.

[nemesiswontdie]

TTS was better than original.

I just died a little inside. I seriously just did. And I think I'm having a heart attack now too.

[Mr. Spencer]

TTS was better than original

Banned.

Also, just to point out the modelling in that game was abysmal.

[Darkmoon]

I never got around to playing the Twin Snakes, so I dunno why it's so awful. Anyone care to explain?

[Vector]

I didn't think it was as terrible as everyone makes it out to be...it wasn't good, but it wasn't awful either. I thought of it as an interesting update to the MGS lore. The main issue is that MGS2 gameplay mechanics completely took away from the challenge that the original game had. For example, it took about two minutes to tranq every single guard in the helipad area and be completely free to run around as you pleased.

Another thing that bothered me, the cutscenes were completely over the top. Seemingly every single action sequence included Snake either dodging bullets Matrix-style, or doing something just absolutely ridiculous. Here's an example: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TH0XlsbEw4o

[rewak]

All TTS was good for in it's time was eye candy, and even that today is fairly weak.

And an HD upscale is any more useful because....?

[Dracarys]

TTS had much better gameplay, the tranq guns and stamina bars for no kill runs, bodies of enemies do not disappear and you need hide them, lockers, dogtags to collect, the boring backtracking sections are shortened, the AI of enemies vastly improved, the VA makes more sense and is more in line with the rest of the series, boss survival, bleeding and bunch of other small but improving changes, a personal fav being not needing to equip a keycard to walk through every single door.

...and it isn't like TTS is the only one guilty of those cutscenes, lets just flip away in slo-mo from a tank cannon. TTS probably did this scene better, he goes flying backwards from the blast and hiits gainst a wall.

http://www.youtube.com/embed/WReo1iYo5xo#t=0m53s

http://www.youtube.com/embed/Ko-l2qHEcpo#t=1m55s

[Rombie]

^ No, Metal Gear Solid 2 had much better gameplay because it added all of those elements you listed for gameplay in an enviroment that actually made use and suited it's inclusion. There is nothing wrong with those gameplay elements but within the MGS game map they were entirely broken because they made the game an all too easy mess.

Darkmoon - See my post, or the other coments about the broken gameplay.

rewak - what does that matter? Well, it was the only thing that the game really had over the original, but even then I was happy putting the game into my Dreamcast and using the Bleemcast disc to play the PS1 original in 480p resolution so it didn't mean that much to me.

[rewak]

My point is this PS3 Trilogy re-release holds nothing more over the original releases than being a HD upscale, so it's pure visuals over anything else if you already own them which most fans will, hell i'm not a fan anymore but i still own the first two.

[Dracarys]

^ No, Metal Gear Solid 2 had much better gameplay because it added all of those elements you listed for gameplay in an enviroment that actually made use and suited it's inclusion.

How does using a tranq on an enemy and then needing hide his body before another guard finds it not suited to the environment? Or AI that notices you or things you've done a lot quicker and easier, that searches better? Especially when dog tag hunting. I'm not seeing huge differences between open areas in TTS and MGS2, nothing stopping you in either. MGS had a first person mode on PC anyway.

[Rombie]

rewak - I'm fine with that too, as I do own them (and TTS), but there are people out there who may have missed out on 3 due to how 2 went out, which is a shame because it's a good game, so I guess it's a chance for people to catch up.

Most of these HD editions add in some sort of trophy support, so for the trophy whores out there I guess it's another perk. Outside of that, my only other thought is one of pure lazyness... I have to drag out my PS1 and PS2 to play them. It would be just my PS2, but I can't even play MGS on my PS2 because the swap disc doesn't work with the old fat design. So having them all on one set which runs on the PS3 is a small bonus. Oh, and MGS still hasn't been released to the PAL PSN store either so thats also an extra perk.

Kylie - Yeah, a not very good one on the PC (and Japanese Intergral PS release). The AI is improved over the PS1 original but the takedowns via Snake's upgrade skill set completley ignore it as an issue. As Chris said, you can clear the Heliport in a couple of minutes by distance FPS takedowns. Once you've cleared everyone in the enviroments from a distance, the locker hiding is moot as no one is still up and around to find any bodies. Unlike MGS2 I don't think I ever bothered hiding bodies in TTS because most areas are wide spaces and enemies very easy to take out, as opposed to more hallways in MGS2.

Because the original MGS map design is mostly large outdoor enviroments like the Helipad, the snowfield, etc and large indoor ones like the Tank Hangar, Warhead Storage, and Rex Hangar where you can spot enemies over large space. Outside of the starting Tanker in MGS2, most of the MGS2 enviroments are quite confined. Even the outdoor ones on the Big Shell are confined by fences, crates, and the like which are limited in use even in TTS.

[Gambit]

Didn't want to make a new thread, so I'll post it here. Yoshikazu Matsuhana is asked about the lack of MGS1 in the HD collection pack, and he follows up with this statement.

Eurogamer reports that Konami wants to "re-imagine" MGS1

"If we were going to do Metal Gear Solid 1 we'd want to take more time with it. Not just up-res the textures, not just make things look pretty and polished, but go back and tweak some of the gameplay, tweak the story to update things and do it properly. Not just a re-master but a re-imagining almost.

"We do want to do that sometime down the road but it will take more time. It's not something we're looking at doing right now."

So, they would be tweaking gameplay (fine with me) and updating the story. I'm curious to see how this product will come out.

[Vito]

^ they could just use TTS then, i actually liked it better than the original (shoot me).

[Vector]

^ they could just use TTS then, i actually liked it better than the original (shoot me).

*empties an entire 9mm clip into your face, reloads, and empties another*

[Gambit]

Wow, Twin Snakes. I remember when Snake literally went crazy because Baker forgot Meryl's codec number.