Creationism vs. Evolution

[Member_of_STARS]

if yal saying that we came from monkeys then where is my tail so i can go to super sayian? 2nd who cares about this crap evolution crap if u think ur came from a monkey then go eat your own crap lol . (USELESS Forum Discussion!)

Ever been in a biology class and heard the term "rudiment"? Or heard stories of babies being born with tails?

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IQ...

[kylehimself]

Exactly what do you define as a "slight difference"?

You act as though the scientific community is full of morons (how playfully ironic). "Slight differences" are recorded as such. Any and all major derivations are recorded as such when the evidence at hand (its fucking remains) indicates that it was different enough to be considered a a new type.

"Man made back stories" is only slightly true. It's really a case of filling in the obvious blanks based on logical conjecture and reasoning. Believe it or not, actual research goes into this stuff.

And evolution is "presented as fact" (its not) because, while it is still a theory, it has enough evidence to at least make it partially true to an extent. And really, you have to be a fucking idiot to say it's 100% false. All you really need to do is observe. It's a slow process (which is one of the main reasons people automatically disbelieve it) but the results are there. Hell, take humans for example. We are some dynamic specimens. The webbing between our fingers and toes is a remnant from our sea-faring days, as is our hair. None of these are actually needed in our present state, and we are projected to lose them in a few hundred years. There are other differences too which have been observed over an even shorter period of time of simply a few decades.

Evolution too is largely caused by mutations through the course of time. That's the basic idea. Natural selection plays hand-in-hand with it in that we change according to our immediate environment in order to ensure our survival. Not only did Darwin observe this several times during the course of his research (finches on the same island with different beaks to allow them to get food in their environment). The general misconception which leads people to jump the gun on evolution is that they do not understand the very basics of the theory. Something will not suddenly become something else. Evolution is the direct result of natural selection. Changes (such as the aformentioned beaks) are minute and supposedly insignificant at first. They are also remote and isolated for the longest time. It is only through the course of time that major changes become apparent on a large scale. Your claim about "slight differences" is just another bullshit misconception caused by close-mindedness.

I believe I've stated a few times already that these people are well educated. I think that’s quite contrary to calling them morons, which I never did.

My question to you was where are all the records of these different types of animals? As I said, on that show with Dick Dawkins they showed around 30 odd different types of elephant species that lead up to what we have now. Now I'm pretty sure that we don't actually have any remains of any of these elephants. So I want to know how all you people are so sure any of it ever existed.

Where are all the remains of these fine chaps?

I don't believe any of these have been found either. I mean, I recognise the guy to the right, and I've seen those wee suckers on the left before. Can't say I've noticed any of those fine gents in the middle though. Why ever did they dissapear off the earth whilst the start and end product remain? Really is odd.

"ugh bu bu bu... missing link." Bullshit, if it was there it would have been found by now.

The best bit in all this is when chaps like our Dick say on TV, "The creatures came out of the sea, and they developed and evolved on land. But then some of them went back in. We don't know why they did this; it's almost a bit contradictory." (Again that was a wee note from Mr. Dawkins this week.)

Ah, where to start. Well firstly the reason you people don't know why they did this is because for start, they didn't. Let’s say they did though, did anybody see it? Nooooooo. Did anybody record it? Nooooooo. So I ask you, how do we know all this happened based on skeletons that have been found? Last I checked corpses weren't very talkative. It's as much proof as me finding a dead body and deciding for myself what this person did all there life and how they lived. I wouldn't know, and I couldn't know unless somebody had documented it live or seen for themselves. Which is something the Bible can claim to have done which evolutionary science can not?

Secondly, I love how when Richard Dawkins explained this contradictory point he looked so baffled. The guy hardly looked like he was convinced himself, but everybody else laps it up. He knew himself there was no evidence to back up such a claim but he pumps this shit out of his mouth regardless.

[kylehimself]

Ever been in a biology class and heard the term "rudiment"? Or heard stories of babies being born with tails?

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IQ...

I seen an Indian baby on the telly born with like 8 limbs? Was his 900X great grandfather a spider?

Pffft.

[Member_of_STARS]

I seen an Indian baby on the telly born with like 8 limbs? Was his 900X great grandfather a spider?

Pffft.

Reading this thread leaves me no doubt where homo sapiens came from.

*shrugs*

[kevstah2004]

[Enrico Marini]

I'm borderline Aethist/Agnostic. If there is some kind of higher being from the nth dimension, I don't think its in the forms of the religions the world has. Thats just how I feel.

To be honest I feel the debate on how we came to be will never be answered, simply because we are inside our little box and without being able to leave our box, we will never understand how the box got there. We can only ever understand what is inside the box.

My only problem with religious people is when they take their texts literally. 7 days to create the universe could mean 7 of God's Days which might not be the same as 7 human days. We don't know how long the information in religious texts was around before it got written down, then there is always a bad translation between languages that could screw up the information. Just look at google/babelfish translations of text, sometimes it turns out coherient, sometimes it comes out gobbledigook, and other times it comes out coherient but is not what was originally written.

I don't believe Evolution to be correct either, its just something at this point in time that helps some people comprehend how we got here. It will be replaced or improved on some time or another and I won't shed a tear or hold onto it like a safety blanket. I did the history of Medicine a long time ago and their scientific theories seemed plausable given the information they had available but eventually got replaced as new information came to light.

All I'll finish on is that I do not need religion or Science to believe in. Maybe one day man might gather enough information to understand the universe, maybe not. I'll just live my days knowing that it is something that cannot be answered. Its wasted energy arguing over such a trivial thing. Arguments beget anger, anger leads to hatred which inevitably leads to the darkside. Just be happy with whatever makes sense to you and just understand that someone else is going to have a different opinion regardless of facts.

[News Bot]

I believe I've stated a few times already that these people are well educated. I think that’s quite contrary to calling them morons, which I never did.

My question to you was where are all the records of these different types of animals? As I said, on that show with Dick Dawkins they showed around 30 odd different types of elephant species that lead up to what we have now. Now I'm pretty sure that we don't actually have any remains of any of these elephants. So I want to know how all you people are so sure any of it ever existed.

Where are all the remains of these fine chaps?

I don't believe any of these have been found either. I mean, I recognise the guy to the right, and I've seen those wee suckers on the left before. Can't say I've noticed any of those fine gents in the middle though. Why ever did they dissapear off the earth whilst the start and end product remain? Really is odd.

"ugh bu bu bu... missing link." Bullshit, if it was there it would have been found by now.

The best bit in all this is when chaps like our Dick say on TV, "The creatures came out of the sea, and they developed and evolved on land. But then some of them went back in. We don't know why they did this; it's almost a bit contradictory." (Again that was a wee note from Mr. Dawkins this week.)

Ah, where to start. Well firstly the reason you people don't know why they did this is because for start, they didn't. Let’s say they did though, did anybody see it? Nooooooo. Did anybody record it? Nooooooo. So I ask you, how do we know all this happened based on skeletons that have been found? Last I checked corpses weren't very talkative. It's as much proof as me finding a dead body and deciding for myself what this person did all there life and how they lived. I wouldn't know, and I couldn't know unless somebody had documented it live or seen for themselves. Which is something the Bible can claim to have done which evolutionary science can not?

Secondly, I love how when Richard Dawkins explained this contradictory point he looked so baffled. The guy hardly looked like he was convinced himself, but everybody else laps it up. He knew himself there was no evidence to back up such a claim but he pumps this shit out of his mouth regardless.

Someone needs to visit a museum.

[WeskerIncarnate]

Cowboy Bebop for the win

Flashback to Cowboy Bebop, Session 6, "Sympathy for the Devil". I remember a scene just like the one here.

Random, and completely off topic. Sorry.

But I'm just glad the community here is not going to chop someone's head off for having a different opinion. There are not so nice places, i.e. YouTube.

Personally, I believe evolution is riddled with bullet holes from the Gatling gun of fallacy.

So many things don't work with each other, many supposed sources (i.e. Haeckl's drawings, the ones comparing the human fetus to that of a fish, were proven wrong. Sorry if I misspelled the name.) were debunked and found to be false.

And all the supposed transitional fossils...yeah, also proven false. It just doesn't end.

[kylehimself]

Someone needs to visit a museum.

Indeed, where I could see many a convincing wax caveman but no real remains to back it up, or a fantastic bunch of well thought out pre historic skeletons based on speculation.

I believe you live in Ireland too good sir. How handy, maybe we should arrange a trip to the museum and I'll go round pointing out all the stuff it doesn’t have.

[News Bot]

but no real remains to back it up

You haven't been visiting a museum.

[Dot50Cal]

My opinion is superior to your's because people told me it is!!!1

[kylehimself]

You haven't been visiting a museum.

Your replies are so convincing and chock-full of evidence... It's almost hard not to be convinced.

[Darkmoon]

Ah, sweet, sweet sarcasm. Actually debate, boys and girls, or be counted as spamming.

[kylehimself]

Ah, sweet, sweet sarcasm. Actually debate, boys and girls, or be counted as spamming.

Where's the fun in that?

[Darkmoon]

Well, it creates an air of actual debate rather than a giant can of procesed pork product. It's not everyone's cup of tea but since I'm the guy with the tea pot...