Resident Evil 0 discussion - Love or hate?

[Zombie Fred]

I am curious to see what people's thoughts are on this title of the series, when reflecting back now it's gone quite a few years since its release. I've been going through the title again and almost finished now (and then moving onto REmake and the rest of the series for my year run through, as part of celebrating its 15th anniversary) and now curious to hearing what other people think on the title, apart from the magic elevator mind fuck.

The game still looks damn good today thanks to the rendered backgrounds and the well crafted models they've worked on to go well with the setting. I thought the training facility was a great addition to go well on how it bridged onto the Spencer estate; its vintage paintings and portraits along the hall, the Victorian inspired architecture that gave the facility its strong presence, and how the place was left in such uncared shape and seeing the place slowly crumbling down. It was just from start to finish the game's pacing went through a nice change of scenarios so the game wasn't trying to keep the player in once place for too long, and It was a great part to experience with the origins on the birth of the T-virus and exploring one of three founders of Umbrella’s “sanctuary” and getting to know a lot more in the mythology the title added (back then I was really into that side of stuff so it was amusing to looking back then and now, seeing as the series has gone into a whole different world in a blink of an eye) in its universe. It's a shame that these titles back then lost that "novel" feeling to its narration and story telling.

The other big change to the usual formula would be the coop edition and the inventory system. This was a love and hate mix to many fans on here but I believe this was one of the sole reasons alone why I love 0 a lot because of the depth item management and teamwork become. The game design worked around trying keeping the players tense on specific parts when you become separated. And when these did happen, I always felt looking that level of safety when you come so comfortable to having an extra person (especially when it come to carrying weapons and items) around with you, it actually added well to what I loved about survival horror games on the psychological aspect.

However, there were some faults I always found disappointing (Biking's lab, I am looking at you!) Although the mix of enemies was appreciated, I always thought the main boss events (Scorpion, Centipede, Bat, etc) was a lot uninspired and only had a very few memorable encounters. But that’s the bane on being the precursor to the series so it’s very difficult to consider what they could do without it being too far out with the rest of the BOWs. However these are only minor compared to the large scale of things when playing the game.
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What are your thoughts on this title?

[Dark_Chris]

great atmosphere, great OST, plausible main characters, horrible story, magic elevator (nuff said).....this game has a lot of potencial to show STARS Bravo team last battle for their lives, but we were given Billy "boring" Coen...that's just sad

this game is 7/10 for me

[Zombie Fred]

great atmosphere, great OST, plausible main characters, horrible story, magic elevator (nuff said).....this game has a lot of potencial to show STARS Bravo team last battle for their lives, but we were given Billy "boring" Coen...that's just sad

this game is 7/10 for me

I have to agree on potential with using Bravo team and seeing their last final hours before the events of remake occurred. But I believe they decided to have that in the background and focus on the story of the training facility revolving around Chambers and Coen, with the rest as subplot those ties into REmake. The story still holds strong by itself, but it’s one of the weakest chapters when you compare the story to the others.

[Dark_Chris]

I also don't like whole Leech Queen idea...Marcus could have been a good villain, but his singing kinda ruined his character for me...

[Upaluppa]

Not again...
I just wanted to edit it, not resubmit.

That's the second time I made such a stupid mistake.
From now on the "previous" arrow in my browser will be forbidden after making a new post.

It won't happen again, for sure this time...

[Upaluppa]

Ranting about the new item system, yeah!

RE0 is sitting high up on the throne of my all-time favorite RE games, even tough it still is a tiny bit lower than RE1 (PSX) and RE2.
There's a lot of good things I could name in this game, but instead of just repeating what others said before me I'll tell you a little about the most troublesome thing in this entire game. (To me, at least)

- The absence of item boxes in combination with the still incredibly limited inventory -

So here's what I did not like about it and why:

Why I prefer the item boxes? Well, because the item boxes where always at the same fixed locations, they had more free space than you'd ever be able to fill with the stuff you can find in a RE game and they all shared the same content.

With the new dropping system however you are forced to do a lot of backtracking at times, just to go back for some puzzle solving item (The grappling hook or whatever it's called comes to mind) you've dropped at the other end of the world because you wanted to do things the save way and carry that huge Grenade Launcher along while exploring new parts of the map.

Another problem is that there's a certain limit to the amount of items you can drop in the same room and if you happen to take every piece of junk you'll find along your journey with you (like I always do) you won't be able to drop all those healing items into one central room, like the main hall of the training facility which would be nice to easily find them again. I just don't like looking around three different rooms just to find a certain ammo type I dropped there because I couldn't drop all my stuff into one room.

Problem number two is that you can drop items behind pillars, tables etc. which sometimes makes it impossible to see and find them again thanks to the predefined camera angles. (I know that there is a map, but I still experienced trouble finding certain items I dropped at unfortunate points again. Bad example: Ever tried to drop something into the sewer water?)

It also takes longer to run around a room looking for items you need to take along than it does to open an item box and pick what you want.
(If your box is well sorted, that is)

I've also had trouble picking the right item in a small room where I dropped a lot of stuff in one place so that it was all laying very close to each other.
Another problem is that if you advance to a new section of the game where you won't be able to return to the previous location some of your stuff may be gone.

One small thing that only started to bother me after replaying the game a few times while trying to obtain the extra weapons/costumes is that the door opening sequences can not be skipped. It just becomes tiresome to watch every door open in a dramatic slow-mo sequence, especially while backtracking through lots of rooms where you already know that nothing fearsome lurks behind the door.

Oh, before I forget, my final (and it's really just a nitpicky, minor one) complaint is that Spoiler:

show spoiler

revived Marcus

looks a little too "girly" for my antagonistic taste (again, just in my opinion).

To be fair, I can't help but think that he would have made a good fantasy RPG character though...

[Chris' Boob]

Marcus was original and perfect, he fit the games atmosphere very well.

RE0 is one of the best.

[Upaluppa]

Marcus was original and perfect, he fit the games atmosphere very well.

RE0 is one of the best.

Well, I'd take him over Wesker any day!
I have nothing particular against Marcus apart from his clothing, which in combination with the high pitched singing voice makes him appear like a girl during his first appearance.

The first time I ever played the game and heard the singing in the Ecliptic Express I could've sworn that mysterious figure standing on the cliff was a woman.

But nobody can deny that he was a very original character, that's absolutely true!
(Especially since Resident Evil's previous character casts were pretty "ordinary", to say so)

Also, I agree that REZero has a very special atmosphere to it, something not found in any other RE game, apart from Code Veronica perhaps, to an extend. I've said in an earlier thread that I was deeply disappointed when I found out that RE4 would not be the promised follow up to REZero and its awesome setting and storyline!

I think it was because of the setting that I liked the game so much!
I totally love Victorian Age (Training Facility), Steampunk (Underground Factory/Laboratory) influenced settings, so that might have been another reason for me to like the game.

Edit:
So it is NOT Marcus who sings there...
Let's just oversee that one line where I wrote "his singing", ok?

[Guest]

I also don't like whole Leech Queen idea...Marcus could have been a good villain, but his singing kinda ruined his character for me...

I have nothing particular against Marcus apart from his clothing, which in combination with the high pitched singing voice makes him appear like a girl during his first appearance.

The first time I ever played the game and heard his singing in the Ecliptic Express I could've sworn that mysterious figure standing on the cliff was a woman.

Okay, I am now convinced that this is a contagious disease. I really can't explain otherwise how people can think that's him singing.

[Upaluppa]

Okay, I am now convinced that this is a contagious disease. I really can't explain otherwise how people can think that's him singing.

Bwaahh, I actually did write "his" singing...
Shame on me...

I never really believed that it was him singing there, but I didn't know for sure either.
Every "RE fan" (with no more knowledge than myself) I've met so far told me he does...
Of course it wouldn't make much sense...

Listen to this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u4dub3ksayw

It's quite obvious that this is not a male voice, I guess.

And what about the singing in the boss music from RE2's final G mutation?
Does anybody think that's G singing there, or what?

Nah, seriously, I thought the person standing on the cliff was a woman during my first-time playthrough with no prior knowledge about Marcus because of the clothing, long hair and the singing voice you can hear during that scene...

I am glad to hear that it is not him (because that would be a bit crappy, wouldn't it?) but can anybody provide some kind of proof or logical explanation why it can't be him? I'd just like to be sure about this topic once and for all!

[Biokk]

I like this game - I liked playing with Rebecca again but I found the overall game experience underwhelming or dare I say it, boring. I think it was an obvious missed opportunity for having the game to play as Rebecca partnering up with the other members of the Bravo team. Even if not as the main game, it would have been a great unlockable game instead of that godawful Leech Hunter game! I must replay it sometime soon though.

[Guest]

I am glad to hear that it is not him (because that would be a bit crappy, wouldn't it?) but can anybody provide some kind of proof or logical explanation why it can't be him? I'd just like to be sure about this topic once and for all!

This being a whole choir rather than a single voice might be a pretty good starting point. Secondly, if the song is a lullaby, then why would the leeches get up and attack people? Thirdly, in the training facility FMV, the voice does not match Marcus's lips at all. Fourthly, if singing controlled the leeches, wouldn't there be an insanely extensive and detailed file in the game trying to apologize for what would be an incredibly stupid decision in the first place? Fifthly, it's called BGM for a reason.

[Upaluppa]

This being a whole choir rather than a single voice might be a pretty good starting point. Secondly, if the song is a lullaby, then why would the leeches get up and attack people? Thirdly, in the training facility FMV, the voice does not match Marcus's lips at all. Fourthly, if singing controlled the leeches, wouldn't there be an insanely extensive and detailed file in the game trying to apologize for what would be an incredibly stupid decision in the first place? Fifthly, it's called BGM for a reason.

Now that sounds plausible enough, I guess...

However, I am not so sure about the lullaby not making the leeches angry...
Who knows what they sing about?

You wouldn't believe how many gruesome lullabies about women being abducted/raped, children being drowned etc. I came across so far...
(I am just joking here, but the gruesome lullabies part is true)

Ok, let's move on and back into "RE0 - Yes or No?" discussion, at least I was not the only one who thought Marcus sings.

And to get the discussion started, who else thinks that RE0 did not focus enough on the S.T.A.R.S. Bravo Team?
I am not really complaining here, I love the game's story as it is and Billy had an interesting history which made him a great character.
I just thought it would've been interesting to find out a little more about Bravo Team's members instead of focusing almost completely on Beccy, Billy and Marcus.

Apart from the prologue, the scene with Edward in the train, Enrico's warnings and his short reappearance at the lab there isn't any interaction with Bravo Team's characters at all...

[rewak]

I don't hate it, but whenever i try to replay it i lose interest after the train, dunno why.

[Reston]

I find Resident Evil 0 to be one of the most under rated titles in the series. Like said before, it captures the style of Resident Evil (2002) with the Victorian Architecture and design.

What I liked:

1. The back story. I was glad that they decided to explore the creators of Umbrella a bit more in this chapter. If you look at the original timeline: RE1-RECV (before Mikami decided to redo the first RE and before RE0 was released or Wesker Report 2), you really never knew much on these people. The only information you had was from the original Trevor letters (if you're a die hard RE fan you know what this is but you gotta be looking for it), the letter about Spencer (the dog collar with the key inside, I believe it's in the original), and then once again mentioned in Code Veronica when Alexander talks about how he needs to make sure this project works otherwise Spencer would take over.

It was an interesting concept and you really didn't even know James Marcus existed unless you played the RE2 N64 version.

The whole mythology regards to Umbrella was really good and neat. I like the information they lead onto.

(I'll get more into this later)

2. The Leeches.

Now I understand a lot of people didn't really like this and I'll be frank, when I first played this I was like, "...the fuck..." but it actually was pretty cool. I mean you got references to dragonflys and ants in Code Veronica, so I didn't see the big issue overall with the use of leeches. I thought it was a new and interesting angle for the storyline.

3. The Singing

I will be honest. I was like, "...Okay so he sings...", it was sort of weird. But then when you read the files and find out that he had queen leeches and baby leeches that thought of him as a father because they grew fond of his voice, (probably because he always said, "foods here!", and fed some poor wandering snooping agent of Spencer's to them, it was pretty cool.

4. Spencer and Marcus

The whole story in terms of mythology was in regards to Spencer and Marcus, the Progenitor Virus, the leeches and how you mix Progenitor with Leech DNA and create T-virus.

But yes, these two people were probably the coolest thing in the entire game. It still didn't make much sense as to what Spencer's goal was, besides controlling Umbrella, but it brought him out into a huge spotlight. We could already rule out money at this point (thanks to WR2 and Marcus journal comment about how Spencer found Progenitor as nothing more than a "money-making tool"), but I remember people used to discuss in heavy detail as to what his motive was.

5. The Partner Switching.

I thought this was really cool and it is sort of sad to see that the whole concept got flushed down the toilet into something that is much more "simpler" because people didn't want to grow custom to it. It was odd at first but you could really get into it. And I believe it was the first game where you actually had a partner in a RE game that actually helped you.

6. Billy Coen

His back story only. I found the entire link from him to Marcus and the situation in Africa was really cool. It was a prelude of things to come. (I'll talk about this also later) Sort of like the Progenitor Virus. Although they didn't get too deep into his story, the tid bits they did show, was enough to make you feel that Billy would play a larger role later in the series.

7. Wesker and Birkin

I loved how they connected William Birkin to Albert Wesker. It made much more sense when you read the file on Wesker's body in REmake, the Wesker Report 2, and then this. I like how they developed their backstory in the files in this game and got more of an understanding of where Wesker came from and not just some "Captain of S.T.A.R.S. that betrayed them for money" like the original game made it seem. Although I wish we seen more of them interacting, it was pretty neat of them to include these two into the story and helped rounded out the series.

8. The Queen Leech

I understand some people may feel crossed at this. I actually liked the fact that the Queen Leech actually was just imitating Marcus and he actually believed he was alive until he "hurled up baby leeches" and lost control of his "replicating" ability when he began to laugh like a lunatic.

(Yes, I'm one of those people who side with the theory that Marcus was really dead and did not come back to life, the leech just copied his DNA and his memory "somehow") and exacted out his revenge.)

Cons:

1. James Marcus's costume.

When I first saw his costume I was confused and didn't understand why the hell did this guy choose that type of clothing. He looked like someone that was rejected from Final Fantasy. And still, to this day, I don't understand where or why he chose that costume. If he wanted to feel the cool air come off from the Arklay Mountains and go underneath his dress, he could've just been naked. I just thought it was stupid and uncommon. I remember someone actually defended his costume and said, "Well he went into the secret room inside the Spencer Mansion and got some clothing and put it on". (The secret room that contains special costumes after you beat the game). Oddly, you could actually say it makes sense but it was just too damn funny.

2. Bravo Team.

What a waste. I feel that this was probably the biggest loss for the writer's staff to mess up. I actually remember, I think it was Shinji Mikami and it was only a year or so ago (whenever he was talking about his last game, I forgot what it's called, reminds me of Halo) they asked him a few questions about Resident Evil and Resident Evil 0. And I guess he said that the biggest regret he had was not keeping in contact on a standard basis with the other staff which had did RE0.

I also remember reading that the guy who was head of the RE0 staff felt that afterwards they should've done a lot more with Bravo team. I mean, I understand that you're out to make a game and a profit but seriously, you could have done a lot more in regards to them. We did get to see what happens to Edward Dewey which is cool. But man, such a waste with Kenneth, Forest, Richard, and Enrico.

3. Connections to RE4.

Progenitor Virus.

At the time, the game seemed to be a prelude for RE4 which was going to deal with the Progenitor Virus. There's even a file (B.O.W. Report) which talks about the use of Progenitor on animals and how useless they are as bio-organic weapons but perhaps using it on humans would make for a more valuable candidate..... And then you had the trailer where Leon got possessed from Progenitor.

Africa.

Wow. Back then, I assumed that RE4 was going to bring the story to Africa with the Progenitor Virus at some point. I mean, they introduced Africa and they even made similarities between the dead bodies that Coen seen stacked up on his mission there and those that he seen in the facility when Rebecca pulls him from the water. Also, it began to make you wonder about how much the U.S. Military played a role in the story. We already knew they played a part in RE3 and REmake had talked about government or military officials having security passcode clearence to the chopper platform. Since Coen was sent there on a mission to take down threats he said they "Gave us the wrong cordinates but no, we couldn't just go home!", it made you wonder how Coen ended up from being "Falsely convicted" and court martialed to being used as a guinea pig and even RE0 has a file that shows the connection between the military and Umbrella.



Conclusion:

It's sad because a lot of RE fans don't appreciate or really care for Resident Evil 0. I am quite confident that if RE4 came out the way it was supposed to (I heard they were gonna use the zapping partner program in RE4), the progenitor virus, and the connection it had with Ozwell Spencer, I felt the series would've been much different. It may have ended with RE4 but the story would have been much more interesting and people wouldn't treat RE0 as the relative you don't want anyone to see.

P.S.

Sorry for the long post.